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How this game's story could feel more completed and FF'ish

Discussion in 'Final Fantasy XV - Spoiler Discussion' started by Paperchampion23, Dec 8, 2016.

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  1. Paperchampion23

    Paperchampion23 PSICOM Soldier

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    This game's development and concepts excited me from day 1. I absolutely love the world. That being said, I was generally disappointed with how the game played out, even though the general story is pretty good. Things were just left....unfinished. Here's how I would have loved to experience this story (with some new, personal preferences I had haha) from the beginning.

    1. Prologue: This and the next section would likely considered story heavy plotlines separate from the main game and not actual chapters. Likely too big for a prologue but a man can dream. Anyway, Kingsglaive and Brotherhood do not exist, everything is in game. The first 10-15 hours or so should have focused on Insomnia. If this game's story really was inspired by FFVII, Insomnia could have most certainly played out like the first disc in VII, similar to Midgar's influence on the story. Actually the game would start with the Empire decimating Galahd and Nyx witnessing it all and being taken in. This is where the the epic would really start. You either watch a healthy amount of cutscenes or play a good section of Noctis's early life, how he meets his his friends. How he learns to get stronger with Gladio, how he learns to be Kingly from Ignis, how he learns to be adventurous with Prompto. All while exploring the city and make the game feel like you belong in this Tokyo-based capital before they throw you into a sprawling world nothing like it. This would cover most of Brotherhoods content. During this, you get to know Nyx a little more, along with Regis and their relationships with the main cast (Ignis and Nyx were friends, according to the short story you can find on the main FFXV website, but you see the game doesn't explain this.), Noctis and perhaps a small relationship with Drautos, why Regis is dying, and why Nyx is important to the events about to happen later.

    2. The real Ch. 0 : The cutscene with the king sending them off happens. I'd say about 5-10 hours in. You've gotten all of this great exposition. You've already had a taste of the combat through some missions within insomnia or while training with Gladio. The bros look like they already have fought together when the game begins, so there definitely could be some things to show that. So here would be where Kingsglaive begins. Loqi should have been introduced here, a small early fight for Nyx. Cor should have been part of the whole situation. Luna comes in after having some good scenes earlier during Noctis's childhood. Her character would be prominent here, just like the movie. Ravus as well, except he wouldn't feel like a different character than the game. Anyway, Drautos--> Glauca, Ardyn, Iedolas, King gets murdered, and final fight all happen here. 10-15 hours into the game, you get the FFXV logo after Nyx dies under the sunrise. BAM. That shit would have hit like a ton of bricks. And it would have made the next section even better. But my point here is Glauca should not have died yet. His importance comes later. Luna escapes. Loqi leaves with the goal to chase Luna and Noctis down after being pronounced dead.

    3. Ch 1: Pushing the car should be exactly the same, it would be a hilarious change of pace after having such an intense climax. Game plays out the way it does till the end of Chapter 1. I thought it was great and would have been better if players could experience everything before.

    4. Ch 2: Its all okay, but should have been longer. Luna escaping and meeting Gentiana was good. Loqi should have had more scenes here. Boss fight was fine. Would have been a good way to get back at the empire in a small meaningful way.

    5. Ch. 3: Okay this is where things should have started to change. The scene with the Niflheim commanders and Iedolas should stay the same, however we see Ravus and Aranea leaving for Lucis, as they are both wildcards and their dynamic could have been interesting. Everything in Lestallum with the weapon searching is fine. Chapters 4 and 5 should have been a part of this chapter. Titan and Ramuh could be important deviations from the phantom weapon search, I didn't have a problem with it. While slow, the game's narrative was fine here I felt. However, when you are getting your car back in Chapter 5 (chapter 3 still here), you should have had an awesome boss fight with Ravus.

    6. Ch. 4: Everything with Aranea, capturing the other Niflheim commander, should play out the way it does, albeit actually explain who Jared was goddamnit. He could have been an important character for the beginning of the game when you are getting introduced to everyone.

    7. Ch. 5: Preparation for Altissia. This is where Gladio leaves temporarily (for his DLC). You leave Lucis after this. Noctis starts to reminisce about Luna a hell of a lot more here. He's excited to see her. It build her character's importance.

    8. Ch. 6: Altissia, fully devoted to getting to know Altissia's character's. The greater part of Accordo is actually more open here. There are more plot developments involving Niflheim and Accordo beyond the tiny chunk of Altissia that they "allow" us to explore. You meet Luna before this happens. She escapes Niflheim and becomes your temporary party member here. You all travel parts of Accordo to do something similar to how you got Ramuh. Because the Regalia is not with you, you use the boat as your main form of transportation. Smaller areas of exploration but makes Accordo exploreable nonetheless. There are towns and another major town aside from Altissia. The Santorini looking town from one of the tech conferences(look it up). You visit places of power to activate Leviathan. Noctis and Luna get to have that important screen time together and it further shows that her place in the world is much more important what was shown. It ends with another Ravus boss fight, as he was with Ardyn there before the party arrives there. Luna goes against him for the last time. He is torn but fights the party nonetheless. Luna fights as well. This incapacitates him for what happens after.

    9. Ch. 7: Niflheim going full force on Altissia and Leviathan. Luna still dies, but because you've had much more screen time with her, its much more impactful.Perhaps the way Luna dies could be done differently. More akin to the Omen trailer? Have Noct kill her not on his own accord. Ardyn makes him do it with the illusion thing. This would haunt him, allowing for some more dark takes on the story. I thought this would be interesting, as it would be the first time a main character in FF does something really tragic like this, as opposed to Ardyn and Luna directly mirroring Sephiroth and Aerith. Plays out a very similar way, except there is more exposition here. Glauca returns. Boss fight with him before Leviathan. He reveals he kills your father and Nyx and is Drautos. Pisses Noctis and Ignis off. Glauca survives the fight, injures Ignis's eyes. Aranea decides to leave Niflheim. Noctis fights Leviathan because he has no choice and he's angry between Glauca and Ardyn stabbing Luna. Great emotional payoff.
    10. Ch. 8: Travel from Accordo to Niflheim. Show them boarding the train from whatever shore town they visit. Give another town like location here. A small town but the trainstation is huge (if you look up FFXV trainstation, Square likely removed out a pretty large trainstation that was fully exploreable, probably would have been here) to give that impact that the structure of the game will change slightly, show that the train is important to getting to Gralea. This is where Noct and the 3 three bros start to get into some problems. They start to forget why they are doing what they are doing. The tension starts to build up once again.

    11. Ch. 9: Town of Cartanica: You can explore the actual town and not just the station. Still has the section with the Marlboro's. Cartanica, like the small hypothetical town before it, is also exploreable. With this, so far FFXV would have 5 pretty sizeable towns as opposed to the 2 that we actually got in game. Lestallum was great but I'd argue that when you are in Lucis, another major town should have existed (it would have been smaller than Lestallum). Ardyn starts to fuck with everyone from here on out.

    12. Ch. 10: The same way it does in Ch 11 and 12 in the actual game. The whole train fight is amazing. Prompto gets knocked off the train for whatever DLC he has. Leads you Tenebrae. It is exploreable, along with some of the fantasy like landscapes around it. Either that or some form of dungeon. You meet some other interesting characters but really the focus would be Ravus. Here is where Ravus's character changes. His sister died. He is angry and upset, remorseful. You fight him in the bed of flowerfields that he talked to his sister in. After you fight him in this emotional and intense 1v1 fight, Noctis kills him simply through anger. Ravus succumbs to his wounds. When they leave, you see Ardyn do something to his body....

    13. Ch. 11: Train continues to Gralea. More train fights, Shiva's whole scene and Ardyn, everything stays the same. But you get to actually do the shiva dungeon that was supposedly cut. Except that Ardyn disappears. You get to Gralea, you are able to explore parts of it. You see that people of Niflheim aren't nearly that evil, only under Imperial rule. You can explore the city with relative ease. The area around Gralea, parts of the mountains are also exploreable. There is a small town somewhere in the mountains that you can travel to. Ardyn has his own agenda and Ravus is "dead", so nobody knows that you are there. You do some cool missions here and there. Perhaps sabotage certain places around. This is where Prompto returns. You start to learn more about the Niflheim heirarchy. Potentially other characters of power come into play here, perhaps not (Square did say that there is a form of a council there in Niflheim.) You meet Verstael. You find out the Prompto father thing. You find out how the Magitek Army is formed. Ending with a pretty decent fight with Verstael. Que emotional scene with Prompto.

    14. Ch. 12: Ch 13 doesn't exist but after you fight Verstael, Ardyn starts to destroy Gralea, unleashing more monster's in the city. The game does become more horror like, I certainly enjoyed the doom aspect of that chapter, while the gameplay was a little odd. That being said. You start to learn way more about the plague of the stars, what Ardyn is trying to do and more. Through Ardyn's destruction, you are able to break in and infiltrate Iedolas's palace. You then see Iedolas, who first summons Glauca to take you out. Both him and Glauca have no idea that Ardyn is behind the deamon destruction, but they continue to fight anyway. It is an emotional turning point in the story, to kill your Father's murderer. As you do this, you are getting flashbacks of Dawn 2.0 scenes where Regis is hugging you. After Iedolas uses the crystal's power to fight you and party. You learn that there is in fact a being with in the crystal (its not just a power source like the game), it sounds like the monster from the Omen trailer talking to Regis (yes, we find out that it is Bahamut, but id lIke to think everything has a more sinister side, so just for fun). You fight and beat Iedolas multiple times. The crystal's being returns to the crystal after. You find out there is some sort of tragic idea behind Iedola's desire for the crystal: he was posessed by it, as were all Niflheim leaders before. Ardyn comes in and kills him in front of you, after killing Verstael. The crystal does not speak anymore. Ardyn seems to be mesmerized by it, he knows what it is. Here he reveals his true nature, that he can summon deamons because of his curse. That he is the first Lucian King. He first summons a possessed Ravus, where he apologizes and tells you to put an end to him. You then have an awesome boss fight with Ardyn here. He destroys you, puts you into the crystal, while releasing the being within the crystal, he tells you that you need to get stronger so that he can kill you at your strongest. Bahamut talks to you in the same way, but it reveals that it actually prevents the Crystal being from leaving the crystal, that was its purpose now. It tells you more about what it is, but doesn't explicitly say why it exists. Bahamut has no reason to be inside the crystal anymore. It allows you to summon it in order to fight them later on. You know you have to sacrifice yourself. Que more of the Dawn 2.0 scene as the Lucii appear in front of your father hugging you crying. He knows your future. It all makes sense, you must die for the world.

    15. Ch. 13: Timeskip, world of ruin. It is exploreable. You also have the power to summon Bahamut here. It is a large part of Lucis and you spend most of this chapter finding your friends and finding out what has happened these last 10 years. I'll leave that up to the imagination of you all. We see the effects of the Plague of the Stars. Daytime settings look exactly like the red environments that we saw in some trailers. Some missions involving it, etc. Ardyn destroyed the bridge to Insomnia, you need an airship to get across. Regalia type F is built. This chapter is largely dedicated to tying up loose ends with the secondary characters. Giving them final missions, and seeing what they are up to. Plus you get to "live" a little in this world of despair. It should be dark and terrifying, almost similar to the chapter before it.

    16. Ch. 14: Insomnia. Plays out similarly but Ifrit is explained a lot more, you can fight Ultros, Diamond weapon, etc on a giant cityscape. The crystal being is taunting you as a voice within. It keeps telling you to kill Ardyn, therefore questioning if you should sacrifice yourself or not. After seeing Luna, Nyx, and Regis dead and strung up by Ardyn, everyone is upset, and Noctis motivates himself to still go through with it. The crystal is pleased. You fight Ardyn the same way, it ends the same. I felt that fight was very personal. Noctis kills himself. However, before you encounter Ardyn in the realm after death, the being reveals itself. I'd personally go with Chaos, but again fill your imaginations with whatever you want. The being reveals that it is the reason for causing Ardyn's immortality and power to summon daemons. Ardyn at this point simply does not care anymore as he just wants you dead, gone. It is the reason for the first plague, convincing Ifrit to betray mankind. Bahamut and the other astrals sealed Chaos inside of the crystal. The kings of Lucis were in charge of not only protecting the crystal from the world, but the world from the crystal. It takes control of Ardyn's astral body. You have an amazing fight between Chaos'd Ardyn. After that Ardyn finally is released, but Luna appears and holds him down only for you to kill him. Ardyn is gone, but Chaos reveals itself, one more fight where you are possessed by the Lucii and that leads to the button prompt from the main game, where you perform the Knights of the Round attack. Nyx (becase he was given the power of the Lucii) and Regis both do the same as Luna did before with Ardyn. Noctis dies soon after. You find that his friends lived after fighting the Iron Giants. The world begins to experience light again. The world was saved. The game ends the way it did. Bittersweat and potentially more beautiful and satisfying because you actually care about the characters.

    17. Ch. 15 Epilogue: Same as it is, except you have the opportunity to explore more of Lucis, Accordo, Niflheim that that you couldn't before.
    It may all be a stretch, but some of this can actually be put in to the game if they expand the plot by way of DLC or patching. Not saying any of this would play out like this, but this is just how I expected the game of this caliber to do its story. It still wouldn't be perfect, but it would really have made people fall in love with a plot that was more unique, yet still had those FF staples (like random plot boss behind the scenes of everything lol). Anyway, hope you all enjoy the read.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2017
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  2. ChingleeTribal

    ChingleeTribal Chocobo Knight

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    Basically what I would want but altered here and there.

    FFXV should have felt THAT grand. It should have felt like multiple scenarios from different areas around the world of Eos was going on and you were apart of it . It should have had alot more scale into terms of story and character development. It should have been much more.

    The game made me realise how I actually didn't want a movie or anime to exist.
    I hope they don't do this multimedia stuff again for FF titles. Just keep it all self contained. Espcially if the games story scenarios will just be skin and bones.
     
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  3. Paperchampion23

    Paperchampion23 PSICOM Soldier

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    Fully agree with that. Honestly love everything except for the games execution of the story, even though I actually like the story itself. It just the potential to be so much more. Granted, some of this could actually be implemented, obviously not in the same way's I'm suggesting. I know many people want to fight Glauca in game, simply because he's so important to the story. Maybe even as a post game quest.
     
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  4. Jubileus

    Jubileus AVALANCHE Warrior

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    Agree with this.

    The concept and story for the game has always been what made me eager to play the game and kept my interest since it was announced long ago.

    You gonna post this in the feedback forum? They're pretty great ideas.

    Ff14's reception was kinda like this game upon release but after the game was fixed many people are loving it.

    Same thing could happen with this game.
     
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  5. Paperchampion23

    Paperchampion23 PSICOM Soldier

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    Lol I honestly never even thought to put it there, I'll do it now haha.

    Edit: Actually edited the first post about how Luna's death. Could possibly be done differently if done right.
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2016
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  6. Storm

    Storm AVALANCHE Warrior

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    it sure could be more complete in the story department, but the game feels FF enough for me.
     
  7. LeonBlade

    LeonBlade Forest Owl Staff Member Moderator Site Staff

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    The game definitely feels like a FF game it's just the story delivery was bad unfortunately. I loved the ending but a lot of the storytelling itself was just bad.
     
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  8. wmlk

    wmlk Yevonite

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    The unfortunate thing is that story patches won't really make things much better. The half-assed underlying game structure is there and won't change with the patches. You can only do so much when the game structure doesn't have a lot of potential to make improvements from.

    This is why Kingsglaive and Omen CG felt shoehorned in. With the current structure, there's only so much you can do to give more exposition.
     
  9. Paperchampion23

    Paperchampion23 PSICOM Soldier

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    I think can still do plenty. Even if they physically didn't expand the game by adding new areas and making the linear portion more open, adding the cutscenes that clarify all of the off screened events would already improve the games story immensely. I know when I play FF games, I usually play to be rewarded by that next story cutscene. That is what's most important to me at least. FFXV really didn't do that, save for several key scenes. It realistically needs a lot more yes, but it's not impossible to solve the story issue, even if some chapters feel pointless.
     
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  10. Storm

    Storm AVALANCHE Warrior

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    man the second half is really barebones; didn't had idea it would be so much.

    it needs smaller areas, one more dungeon, more cutscenes to build momentum; it felt rushed.

    also the second continent looks amazing (it really feels like a foreign land), a shame that elevator on the station can't go down.

    edit:

    [​IMG]

    guys where do you think this station was located? lol

    it seems gralean architecture, you can see a lot tubes on the lower part.
     
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2016
  11. Jubileus

    Jubileus AVALANCHE Warrior

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    I remember seeing this way back and then wondering whether it was going to be in the game.

    Good question. Seems to be somewhere in the continent of Niflheim. Perhaps another cut area? Can't see Noctis casually walking around Gralea all carefree like lol. He's practically asking to be arrested xD
     
  12. LeonBlade

    LeonBlade Forest Owl Staff Member Moderator Site Staff

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    I don't know what Gralean architecture looks like, but yeah... not in the game...
     
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  13. Jubileus

    Jubileus AVALANCHE Warrior

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    It make me wonder just how much was actually cut from the game, and why?

    We know that not having enough time is one issue, and probably some set pieces not having a place in the story anymore could be another.

    Most of the stuff in the old trailers weren't in the game so perhaps they will be added via the story update patch?

    Really makes you wonder what staff go through during game development. Being a public company, I guess that even the most smallest of changes and decisions have to go through a lot of channels before getting permission to do something and get it done, which takes up a lot of time and slows down development considerably.
     
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  14. Storm

    Storm AVALANCHE Warrior

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    it looks like a industrial german city with high skyscrapers

    the station seems to be part of it because of the pipes/tubes which evokes a machinery theme.
     
  15. Paperchampion23

    Paperchampion23 PSICOM Soldier

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    [​IMG]
    These two environments were removed from the game at some point as well. They do say concept models/prototypes under these images though. The santorini town actually looks like it could have been another town in Accordo though.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    It also looks like parts of insomnia were supposed to be exploreable unless these are concept renders, but look in game. Perhaps we'll get some DLC exploring the Bros past and their life in Insomnia so we can explore it....or maybe a post-game Infinite Dungeon added later :D

    [​IMG]
    just some other concept areas.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    This even shows that the city is at least completely modeled in game. There are loading screens in game that show this another area entirely at a different time of day within Insomnia. Just look at how all of the buildings are affected. Interests me why you would take so much time to develop a fully realized city and not use it. Same with Tenebrae and Cartanica....



    [​IMG]

    Sigh...when this actually looked like you could leave and explore town. AND, the other side of this town (the other side of the trainstation) actually looks like a damn city! Bigger than Lestallum! (couldn't get a picture) It has roads and everything and you can even see cars driving along it!

    But tenebrae: http://imgur.com/a/yo5Pf If not an exploreable hub, it should have been a dungeon at least. Look how Dark Souls-ish that castle looks!


    Edit: I swear though, I'd buy this game a second time (meaning i'd just have two copies for no reason lol) if they actually revamp the game to include places like this. I've said this before but if they make Tenebrae a large dungeon (so that way it doesnt change the story that it was attacked) during chapter 12, Gralea and Insomnia infinite post game dungeons with beyond lvl 99 Magitek Enemies and Daemons for each city respectively (Some crazy new giant magitek enemies for Gralea and how about Ultros/Diamond Weapon/Cerberus for Insomnia?) that have some points of interests around the city (meaning they are fully open, separate maps that just have tons of new little things to do), Cartanica and parts of this continent actually exploreable during ch 10, expand Altissia/Accordo in Ch 8. in ANY way, maybe even that large trainstation that was cut. If they do any of this, combined with the new cutscenes they are expected to add, plus the DLC stories that should expand the world even more, I'd be super content with the game we have. These locations look beautiful. Its a shame that a lot of it just goes...to waste. Allow us to just run free in them, even if you had to charge money for it to add interiors or textures and finish locations!
     
    Last edited: Dec 12, 2016
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  16. LeonBlade

    LeonBlade Forest Owl Staff Member Moderator Site Staff

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    They are going to add more onto the game, I wouldn't worry about it so much.
     
  17. APZonerunner

    APZonerunner Network Boss-man Staff Member Administrator Site Staff UFFSite Veteran

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    Would be very surprised to see patches and DLC add stuff this significant, though. A lot of this is probably gone forever, for better or worse.
     
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  18. Jubileus

    Jubileus AVALANCHE Warrior

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    Feedback forum this?

    Stuff looks amazing and if they already finished the assets for this then why not use it?

    I'd buy it a second time too if all this stuff is included like you said.

    You do have a point. I can see some people being ecstatic (that would be me) and some people being downright pissed off.

    All depends on your outlook for games. I'm ok with devs adding more stuff in later on since I know game development is extremely complicated and shit happens.
     
  19. Storm

    Storm AVALANCHE Warrior

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    tabata said on the IGN event he wants to add more areas, i don't know if this means the areas will be tied to DLCs like episode gladio and so on, but i don't see why they wouldnt add them to the main game after that.

    we'll see anyway, FFXV is a very special case i'm hopeful for a big support during the year.
     
    Last edited: Dec 12, 2016
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  20. 1 0 0 0

    1 0 0 0 Stiltzkin's Apprentice

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    in your chapter 0 just wondering how you would feel if the original idea of noctis's party escaping was implemented somehow? would have had more feeling running out of insomnia whilst being in the thick of it all.
     
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