Final Fantasy XV - General News Thread

[Paperchampion23]

Spoiler

Ardyn is still the main villain in the canon route though. Besides the fact that they confirmed EP. Ardyn's "Submit your Fate" choice as the canon to the main game, it's still possible to interperate Bahamut's motivation as a means of fate being fate without malicious intention.

Spoiler

Its not even that, both show Bahamut is essentially the villain anyway. It really doesnt matter how Ardyn chooses. One just shows that Bahamut was more evil than initially let on. Ardyns episode kind of ruined how I feel about the main ending now. Combined with all of this new info its just really depressing.

They told us they were gonna save the game, then they told us they werent, its just kills all my faith for square on their next FF outing, especially 7R. It will not be a day 1 purchase for me. They lost that kind of trust on my end.

 

[Loganight]

The scenes of Bahamut at the end of Comrades used to be my favorite scenes from the entire game, hard to look at them the same way now knowing what we know about Bahamut. Just makes everything he says sound like lip service and drains it of a bit of its grandiose weight.

 

[Nova]

Spoiler

Its not even that, both show Bahamut is essentially the villain anyway. It really doesnt matter how Ardyn chooses. One just shows that Bahamut was more evil than initially let on. Ardyns episode kind of ruined how I feel about the main ending now. Combined with all of this new info its just really depressing.

They told us they were gonna save the game, then they told us they werent, its just kills all my faith for square on their next FF outing, especially 7R. It will not be a day 1 purchase for me. They lost that kind of trust on my end.

Spoiler

It technically doesn't though, at least when considering the canon option (and re-contextualization) more instead of the one where it clearly leads into the Alternate finale.

Bahamut's entire character is portrayed to essentially be the retainer of Fate, while the new revelation of Ardyn releasing the starscourge actually being part of the plan to end it all along dismisses theories of it being unexpected, there still leaves room to infer Bahamut's plan as is as an act of spiritual discernment for the greater good. The DoTF throws this out of the window by turning him into a full-blown humanity executioner in order make the concept happen.

As for Ardyn, while certainly tragic he wasn't innocent with his motives even prior to being cursed. Its pretty accurate to assume that he is more of a victim of his own messiah complex than the other way around.

 

[Bazztek]

I didn`t mean to provoke such strong emotions from you (deducing from the overtly-long-sream-of-though sentences), I don`t want to argue - it`s just I simply can have another point of view.

Spoiler: KH3 secret ending

1:31

if

Spoiler

you can`t hear Somnus

they I`m afraid I can`t help you.

I`m not saying we`re getting VersusXIII, Verum Rex or anything specifically, because I don`t work at SE, but clearly they left the (lore) back door open for a reason.
That`s all I`m saying. And instead of throwing sh*t at eachother telling how some *hypothetical* game would be more or less than XV to Vs. let`s just patiently wait and see. I`m sure we`re in for a treat.


Now back to DotF, reading the spoilers, MAN were they ambitious if they really wanted to implement all of that in the DLCs?!

Well again I already said there was superficial similarities, which would include that musical reference too, and on that note regarding the Somnus theme itself.

Take a listen to this music section from the 1996 Romeo+Juliet, not only does the music sound like it was used as a temp or reference for Somnus as its also using those same chords, but the whole scene itself feels like it was an influence for the Versus scene in the peace treaty party too.

Now you might think so what if there is a similarity there, but the thing is the 1996 Romeo+Juliet was directed by Baz Luhrmann who Nomura has stated is his biggest cinematic influence.

While still on the topic of film, Nomura told us that he likes to leave work at work, so he tends not to play a whole lot of games at home. Instead, he consumes movies like a junky – 2 or 3 of them on most nights. His biggest cinematic inspiration is Baz Lurhman, the visionary Australian director behind Romeo + Juliet, Moulin Rouge, and most recently The Great Gatsby.

https://ign.com/articles/2013/06/13/e3-2013-final-fantasy-xv-was-almost-a-musical

Not only that but the 2008 Versus trailer feels like it was directly influenced from the intro of the movie too and like the music was used as reference to inform Omnis Lacrima, even it starting with a news report too.

So I think that Verum Rex having a reference to the Somnus theme is more it being a reference to the music Somnus was influenced from, hence the similarity.

 

[Ikkin]

Spoiler

Super late to the party here but this fucking book was a massive mistake.

All its doing is pissing off their fanbase even more for cancelling this stuff. Regardless if was "alternative" content, it meant more FFXV lore to begin with and completely ties up most of the missing major points in the game.

Episode Aranea: Diamond Weapon? Gralea? Seriously? You cancel the opportunity and remove this set piece? JFC. This would have SOLVED ALL OF MY NIFLHEIM PROBLEMS.

Episode Luna: More Nifleheim? Sapphire Weapon? More WoR? Setting up Bahamuts downfall? Yes, I get the logic behind making Bahamut a pure villain is some pretty contrived retconning, but shit, I would have loved this.

Episode Noctis: I don't even want to talk about. This shit sounded too epic.

All in all, the only thing I would have changed would have been the idea that it was an alternative ending, but rather a method to preventing the first future. Unsure how they could have pulled this off, but it would have been cool for people to choose their outcomes based on the story.

Honestly, I'm actually really mad I read any of this. I would have rather not known their plans. And this completely ruins the base game for me in ways because now I KNOW there was supposed to be 7 more layers on top of what we got.

Pissed of Square. This is probably the most disappointing thing you could have done to Final Fantasy and its fanbase. I haven't even touched Episode Ardyn because it technically hints at a large majority of this stuff. I personally can't. Its too disappointing for me.


Edit: Actually, WAIT. They DO explain how this DLC ties into everything. Everything from Chapter 14 on is actually a vision from Bahamut given to Luna, or at least on their terms. I'm actually totally okay with this route believe it or not, as much as I love the original ending, it left a lot unsaid. One day Square needs to make this right. One day.

Eww eww eww eww, that idea is the literal worst. I reject it wholeheartedly and would boycott the work of everyone responsible on principle if they ever tried to rewrite FFXV that way. DX<

The scenes of Bahamut at the end of Comrades used to be my favorite scenes from the entire game, hard to look at them the same way now knowing what we know about Bahamut. Just makes everything he says sound like lip service and drains it of a bit of its grandiose weight.

We don't know anything new about Bahamut. DotF Bahamut is literally a different character.

Spoiler

*cough*Bhunivelzeindragonarmor*cough*

 

[Bazztek]

DotF Bahamut immidieately made me think of Bhunivelze, it does feel FNCish. And the thing is I've always had this feeling that LR used aspects that were originally intended for Versus's story in it instead, like they even had people that suddenly worship Etro too like it was set in Versus, which wasn't even a thing in XIII or XIII-2. And I remember when Toriyama once said that the Etro in FF13 series is the same Etro in XV back when it was FNC even though they are different stories.

"When Etro is mentioned in the context of XIII and XV, we’re referring to the same goddess of Death. It’s the same goddess, but how she’s featured, how she appears and how she’s involved with the story is completely different. They’re different stories and different projects. So while it’s the same character, her involvement is very different."

https://ign.com/articles/2013/10/28/final-fantasy-15-may-be-linked-to-final-fantasy-13

 

[Loganight]

Eww eww eww eww, that idea is the literal worst. I reject it wholeheartedly and would boycott the work of everyone responsible on principle if they ever tried to rewrite FFXV that way. DX<



We don't know anything new about Bahamut. DotF Bahamut is literally a different character.

Spoiler

*cough*Bhunivelzeindragonarmor*cough*

Even the revelations we receive in Episode Ardyn kind of change how I look at him. It's unfortunate, though you're not wrong they really aren't the same character.

 

[SonOfEtro]

DotF Bahamut immidieately made me think of Bhunivelze, it does feel FNCish. And the thing is I've always had this feeling that LR used aspects that were originally intended for Versus's story in it instead, like they even had people that suddenly worship Etro too like it was set in Versus, which wasn't even a thing in XIII or XIII-2. And I remember when Toriyama once said that the Etro in FF13 series is the same Etro in XV back when it was FNC even though they are different stories.


https://ign.com/articles/2013/10/28/final-fantasy-15-may-be-linked-to-final-fantasy-13

I was thinking that too when I was looking at the summary while translating.

Spoiler

Something else about Bahamut's portrayal is the fact that they draw more of his DotF version from the overall FF interpretation of the dragon Bahamut' destructive, and potentially devastating to anything and everything in addition to being the most powerful summon in the world. Also, his attack at the book's final is straight out of the different portrayals of Tera Flare; lots of Bahamuts, and lots of destruction. It may have a mixed impact on XV's lore, but it feels more like an FF rather than a WRPG trying for an FF feel.

 

[Paperchampion23]

Eww eww eww eww, that idea is the literal worst. I reject it wholeheartedly and would boycott the work of everyone responsible on principle if they ever tried to rewrite FFXV that way. DX<



We don't know anything new about Bahamut. DotF Bahamut is literally a different character.

Spoiler

*cough*Bhunivelzeindragonarmor*cough*

As much I personally agree and hate an alternative ending, we lose so much more than that.

As a result, we don't get:

- Any Niflheim/Gralea content
- A potential Diamond/Sapphire weapon fight
- Playable Luna or Aranea
- Playable WoR and additional story there
- Additional bosses and tons of new lore bits.


This is sad.

 

[FFChocobo18]

As much I personally agree and hate an alternative ending, we lose so much more than that.

As a result, we don't get:

- Any Niflheim/Gralea content
- A potential Diamond/Sapphire weapon fight
- Playable Luna or Aranea
- Playable WoR and additional story there
- Additional bosses and tons of new lore bits.


This is sad.

If they ever do a remake for FFXV someday, not any time soon as it's still 'new', this 'remake' should be more based on what Dawn of The Future was out to tell with the novel's story, with all of the prevous DLCs integrated in said 'remake', with Episode Ardyn serving as the 'remake's prologue, with all of the other Dawn of The Future content as part of the second half there. But I doubt any FFXV remake will come out any time soon, perhaps one day they'd do a FFXV remake, and I would buy it, especially if it was more based on Dawn of The Future.

 

[ash]

https://autumnstwilight.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F184508038383

Spoiler

I'm gonna assume that the lore bits are actually canon, but used to define an alternate ending. GUYS THERE WAS INFORMATION ABOUT ODIN BEING A MESSENGER IN THE GAME. AND BAHAMUT FOUGHT THE OTHER ASTRALS which makes "gods fighting" make so much more sense than just Ifrit by himself against all the other five. I always wondered why they just jumped to the final result of him being entombed on Rock of Ravatough/ dying without giving any context. I think they were avoiding the Bahamut bit to make the main narrative more cohesive.

Oh, FFXV. What you really could have been is something I will wonder for the rest of my life.

 

[Ikkin]

DotF Bahamut immidieately made me think of Bhunivelze, it does feel FNCish. And the thing is I've always had this feeling that LR used aspects that were originally intended for Versus's story in it instead, like they even had people that suddenly worship Etro too like it was set in Versus, which wasn't even a thing in XIII or XIII-2. And I remember when Toriyama once said that the Etro in FF13 series is the same Etro in XV back when it was FNC even though they are different stories.

Yeah, I've always kind of wondered about that, given some similarities between LR's direction and the direction I perceived in Kingdom Hearts (which I think is also currently drawing on unused Versus concepts), but I'm mostly convinced now that some of the ideas from Versus XIII might have been scavenged for XIII-2 and LR. >_>;

Even the revelations we receive in Episode Ardyn kind of change how I look at him. It's unfortunate, though you're not wrong they really aren't the same character.

Well, all Episode Ardyn really does is make him more of a fatalist, if you take that Bahamut to be canon Bahamut. (I don't think he was meant to be, but it's not that hard to fit the two together.)

As much I personally agree and hate an alternative ending, we lose so much more than that.

As a result, we don't get:

- Any Niflheim/Gralea content
- A potential Diamond/Sapphire weapon fight
- Playable Luna or Aranea
- Playable WoR and additional story there
- Additional bosses and tons of new lore bits.


This is sad.

To be fair, the Episode Aranea stuff sounds pretty awesome, as long as Episodes Luna and Noct are consigned to the AU novel bin where they belong. The "tons of new lore bits" are actively counterproductive more often than not.

Then again, Episode Aranea also sounds impractically expensive, so I'm not surprised that it wasn't completed even if it could have been rendered canon-compliant.

If they ever do a remake for FFXV someday, not any time soon as it's still 'new', this 'remake' should be more based on what Dawn of The Future was out to tell with the novel's story, with all of the prevous DLCs integrated in said 'remake', with Episode Ardyn serving as the 'remake's prologue, with all of the other Dawn of The Future content as part of the second half there. But I doubt any FFXV remake will come out any time soon, perhaps one day they'd do a FFXV remake, and I would buy it, especially if it was more based on Dawn of The Future.

Why bother calling it a remake? Just call it "Final Fantasy Versus XV" and call it a day. =P

https://autumnstwilight.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F184508038383

Spoiler

I'm gonna assume that the lore bits are actually canon, but used to define an alternate ending. GUYS THERE WAS INFORMATION ABOUT ODIN BEING A MESSENGER IN THE GAME. AND BAHAMUT FOUGHT THE OTHER ASTRALS which makes "gods fighting" make so much more sense than just Ifrit by himself against all the other five. I always wondered why they just jumped to the final result of him being entombed on Rock of Ravatough/ dying without giving any context. I think they were avoiding the Bahamut bit to make the main narrative more cohesive.

Oh, FFXV. What you really could have been is something I will wonder for the rest of my life.

Spoiler

Nah, while it seems reasonable to assume that Odin is a Messenger (given that Garuda is one), Bahamut deciding to try to kill the rest of the Astrals and destroy Eos to boot is nonsense in the context of canon. It makes far more sense that it's a poorly-executed retcon than something that was avoided to make the main narrative more cohesive.

 

[Paperchampion23]

To be fair, the Episode Aranea stuff sounds pretty awesome, as long as Episodes Luna and Noct are consigned to the AU novel bin where they belong. The "tons of new lore bits" are actively counterproductive more often than not.

Then again, Episode Aranea also sounds impractically expensive, so I'm not surprised that it wasn't completed even if it could have been rendered canon-compliant.

Yeah, but unfortunately, Aranea's episode seems to tie into Luna's in a way, with the discovery of Sol as being the heir to Gralea's throne (who in turn seems to be a party member in Luna's DLC). It also seems that were Aranea's DLC ends, Luna's begins. So I'm honestly not sure how well Aranea's would have worked in the main canon as well.

Regardless, I could have rolled with the whole thing if it meant more FFXV. This just kind of bothers me, only in that they literally told us their plans only to cancel it. The game was already flawed, and saw a bunch of fans at a low point after waiting 10 years. Then they get those fans excited again, only to drag them down a 3rd time. Its a pretty rough way to part with this game.

 

[Bazztek]

Yeah, but unfortunately, Aranea's episode seems to tie into Luna's in a way, with the discovery of Sol as being the heir to Gralea's throne (who in turn seems to be a party member in Luna's DLC). It also seems that were Aranea's DLC ends, Luna's begins. So I'm honestly not sure how well Aranea's would have worked in the main canon as well.

Regardless, I could have rolled with the whole thing if it meant more FFXV. This just kind of bothers me, only in that they literally told us their plans only to cancel it. The game was already flawed, and saw a bunch of fans at a low point after waiting 10 years. Then they get those fans excited again, only to drag them down a 3rd time. Its a pretty rough way to part with this game.

The character of Sol in Ep Aranea doesn't contradict anything in the canon, the Episode Luna stuff with her is basically just "alt timeline Sol with Luna" so doesn't actually really connect to the Ep Aranea stuff per se.

 

[Ikkin]

The character of Sol in Ep Aranea doesn't contradict anything in the canon, the Episode Luna stuff with her is basically just "alt timeline Sol with Luna" so doesn't actually really connect to the Ep Aranea stuff per se.

Not to mention, Sol is a far more appealing character when she's a girl who Aranea has to adopt, allowing for further development of Aranea, rather than an obnoxious anti-religious Author Avatar. >_>;

 

[Loganight]

Spoiler

In regards to Odin being mentioned, it's curious that we have this concept art of what is assumedly him fighting off Bahamut and a bunch of Bahamut clones near the citadel. I'm curious how much they drew on the concepts of this era of Versus/XV's development for the ending of DoTF.

Also Bahamut nuking the other Astrals is so stupid and makes that scene of all of them converging in Comrades even more dumb since they'd have every reason to hate Bahamut and stand against him, not at his side.

 

[ash]

Spoiler

In regards to Odin being mentioned, it's curious that we have this concept art of what is assumedly him fighting off Bahamut and a bunch of Bahamut clones near the citadel. I'm curious how much they drew on the concepts of this era of Versus/XV's development for the ending of DoTF.

Also Bahamut nuking the other Astrals is so stupid and makes that scene of all of them converging in Comrades even more dumb since they'd have every reason to hate Bahamut and stand against him, not at his side.

I completely forgot that concept art piece existed!

 

[ash]

Not to mention, Sol is a far more appealing character when she's a girl who Aranea has to adopt, allowing for further development of Aranea, rather than an obnoxious anti-religious Author Avatar. >_>;

I thought it was just meant to mirror some modern anti-religious schools of thought it an attempt to make her more relatable to some of today's experiences, but I also thought it was too cliche and FFXIII:LR-isc.

 

[CloudBuster]

I'm just curious as to what role Ravus has in this alternative ending since he's prominently featured on the cover for DoTF. Also after seeing that Odin vs Bahamut clones image I'm beginning to think that DoTF might not be as random as people are thinking it is. It's looking more and more like they brought back the aspects of FNC that were originally removed in order to separate FFXV from the XIII subset of games. It just screams "Hey it seems you guys really liked the FNC stuff from Versus so we're bringing it back to you now in this alternate ending."

 

[Loganight]

Throwback to this, I guess this is what the end of Dawn of The Future would have looked like lol

It really does seem like they pulled heavily from the FNC side of Versus, which is unfortunate because I'm way more in love with the small touches like Ardyn in the car at the start of his DLC or the similarities between Noctis in the Versus reveal trailer and Armiger Unleashed's animations.