Final Fantasy XV is about 50-60% complete as a "Whole"

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Sep 26, 2013
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#22
I think they're just using Noctis as an example here.

Basically the player can only control one character. Everyone else is AI.

If you switch to a different character, then that character you previously controlled will become AI.

And because FFXV has a FFXII style gambit system now, you can adjust how the AI behaves.
 
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Starlord

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May 14, 2014
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#23
You've gotta be kidding me. Out of all 4 guys, we're constraint only to Noctis's shoes?!

http://gematsu.com/2014/09/final-fantasy-xv-director-talks-development-open-world-combat-demo#c8cmXJ7vLJhi8tVa.99

Oh dear...
I don't know, it really sounds like he's referring to the demo in question. In fact the whole article gave the sense of what we are going to see in the demo. the game is still a ways off for them to say " Noctis is the only playable character." Only reason he said that is because the demo will only have Noctis as a playable character.

I think they're just using Noctis as an example here.

Basically the player can only control one character. Everyone else is AI.

If you switch to a different character, then that character you previously controlled will become AI.
I agree with that!
 
Jul 29, 2014
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Miami
#25
I think they're just using Noctis as an example here.

Basically the player can only control one character. Everyone else is AI.

If you switch to a different character, then that character you previously controlled will become AI.

And because FFXV has a FFXII style gambit system now, you can adjust how the AI behaves.
Oh, good. Had a mini freak-out there.

"Erren Van Duine" said:
Sounds like XV's battle system has a lot of automation. Tabata calls it a simplified version of Type-0's control systems.
Now this is concerning. Sounding more & more like a typical buttton-masher to me...
 

Starlord

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May 14, 2014
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#27
"In battle, you switch from offense to defense and vice versa. The only character that the player is in direct control of is Noctis, however, the other characters will act according to tactics that the player set beforehand."

Direct control and Playable characters are two different things. Tabata was explaining that when you have control over Noctis you can't control the other members. SO the Gambit system comes into play so you can change their behavior in battle. They never said " Noctis is the only playable character. They only said in a nutshell, " When controlling Noctis you cannot control the other party members. ( Basically, a FFXII battle system in a action format.)

This is what Duckroll says from Neogaf ( an Admin):

(I checked out the 4Gamer interview, and regarding the playable character thing...

When Tabata says that the player only controls Noctis and the other characters have AI commands, it sounds more like he's describing how the system works as it is. In the demo shown so far, the only playable character in Noctis. It could be that they have removed character swapping, but it could also just be him describing the fact that as an action RPG you only control a single character. At the same time, he does talk about how the game is very much about Noctis and his friends "helping each other", so that might be why only Noctis is playable.

The important points he highlights is that there will be AI settings in the menu which can be changed, and the player will have a degree of control over the battle flow.")
 
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LeonBlade

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#28
I am extremely pissed off if this battle system is just "create a combo system in a menu and hold X to win". FUCK, we get more information and all we get is Tabata pissing on everyone that wants a KH style battle system. We really need to get some clarification ASAP... if not, there will be a huge backlash from fans.

I don't want to hold X to win... I want to have freedom to switch my weapon WHEN I want on the FLY not fucking pre-program a combo string and hold a button down and go to sleep while Noctis kills shit for me. I don't care if this shit is optional, just don't make it the only way, otherwise I will not buy this game when it comes out, I've been excited for this game's possibilities for so long... everything is lining up to be great, ALL of the rest of the news so far has been EXACTLY what I've wanted to hear... and then when I get to the combat, it falls flat on its face and I want to cry.

Please allow people to play SOMETHING at Jump Festa so that we can get a better idea of what's going on here, please give us something to clarify what's going on, because this is really concerning...

Tabata... please don't fuck this up...

To quote Kagari: "This sounds like... they made it easy for casuals."
 

Takoyaki

SOLDIER Second Class
May 27, 2014
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#29
Battle system is not jiving with me. It sounds stupid.

I understand the E32013 stuff might not have all worked... but this is so simplified.
 

LeonBlade

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#32
Lets be honest here; you will buy the game regardless. I know I will. :chocowalk:
No, I honestly won't... I'll buy Kingdom Hearts III instead. I don't care if the battle system isn't a direct copy of KH (although I think it should be), making it piss easy like this is disgusting.

To quote someone in NeoGAF:
So the negatives out of this combat system:
- Holding "Attack" for continuous string of attacks instead of manual pressing for better feedback
- Holding "Guard" for continuous dodging, and no manual dodge roll
- No Manual Weapon Switching
- No Manual Party Assists
- No Party Switching (only Noctis playable?)

It's basically set up your weapons, and then just hold the "Attack" button and let the AI do its thing. How is that fun?

What it should have been:
- Mash attack for every single attack
- Can manually switch weapons with a button (like say L1)
- Can manually call for party assists when close by with a button (say Square)
- Can manually switch to other party members with a button (say R1)
- Have the KH like command menu for each character (or map to face buttons)
- Have the FFXII gambits for ordering other characters when you're not controlling them
Edit: Male only cast doesn't even bother me, this is what they've been saying for a long time now, the combat is a deal breaker for me, that's one of the biggest reasons why I wanted to play this game. Taking a look back at the old Versus XIII combat trailers makes me excited, thinking about how this will play out makes me want to throw up like XV is a girlfriend that just broke up with me after an 8 year long relationship.
 

Starlord

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May 14, 2014
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#33
I really like to see where Tabata Actually says " You can only Hold a button down before you can do anything". I just don't see it

From this:

combat isn’t about pressing a button once for a single action to happen.

“Rather, they are a continuous flow of movements,” Tabata told Kotaku. “It’s more about the movements that are associated with the buttons and building upon them for actions through the combat system.”

-If I were to put what is said on a button layout I see it as this

Triangle does " Attack/Attack/Attack
Square does " Defend/Attack/Defend
Circle does "Magic/Magic/Defend
X does " Magic/Attack/Defend

These are just examples, but you can customize all these " Predetermine actions any time you want"

Technically if you really wanted too, you could Just set 1 command on each Button and Hit/hold to use that one command.

I just don't see this as a Hold 1 button to win. and I think this interview about the comabt is kinda to early to tell. Remember FFXIII demo? That battle system was different from the final version. I just don't think we are getting the full picture but only a slice of the pie they are describing.
 

LeonBlade

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#34
Oh wow. You must be really pissed by their design choices. I am too.

Pressing and hold to preform a move sucks ass. That does not sound very 'action' for an Action Role-Playing game.
The combat should be fast pace and in parallel to various buttons being clicked to preform the moves. That sounds like a game I could spend hours on......

This is absolute bullshit I'm getting from Square. It has to be.
Yes, I am very upset. I don't mind if they change the battle system, I just want my attacks to have the tactile feel and my combos to string the way I want them to... I want to be able to block/parry when I want to... not hold down a button and let the game play for me.

I really like to see where Tabata Actually says " You can only Hold a button down before you can do anything". I just don't see it

From this:

combat isn’t about pressing a button once for a single action to happen.

“Rather, they are a continuous flow of movements,” Tabata told Kotaku. “It’s more about the movements that are associated with the buttons and building upon them for actions through the combat system.”

-If I were to put what is said on a button layout I see it as this

Triangle does " Attack/Attack/Attack
Square does " Defend/Attack/Defend
Circle does "Magic/Magic/Defend
X does " Magic/Attack/Defend

These are just examples, but you can customize all these " Predetermine actions any time you want"

Technically if you really wanted too, you could Just set 1 command on each Button and Hit/hold to use that one command.

I just don't see this as a Hold 1 button to win. and I think this interview about the comabt is kinda to early to tell. Remember FFXIII demo? That battle system was different from the final version. I just don't think we are getting the full picture but only a slice of the pie they are describing.
This is what he said:
Speaking to 4Gamer, Tabata said gameplay is less about focusing on menus and more about playing around and navigating 3D spaces, albeit with predetermined moves. He describes it as similar to Final Fantasy XII‘s Gambit System.

There are no menu commands in combat. It controls like an action game where players switch between offense and defense. You can only control Noctis, but you can give orders to other party members. And there are menus to give commands to everyone, swap out weapons, etc.

Weapons are set in a deck. During battle, the deck will choose the most appropriate weapon for the battle based on the situation.
Source: http://gematsu.com/2014/09/final-fa...nt-open-world-combat-demo#4zRwaxD0breSEGRC.99

Also, let me say, your idea of pre-programming commands like that I think is terrible, and I would utterly hate the idea of it, it just reminds me of FFXIII to chain combos together... FFXIII's battle system was shit, I don't want to play FFXIII, I want to play XV... and XV should be what Nomura envisioned, not this watered down hold X to win.
 

Starlord

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May 14, 2014
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#35
Yes, I am very upset. I don't mind if they change the battle system, I just want my attacks to have the tactile feel and my combos to string the way I want them to... I want to be able to block/parry when I want to... not hold down a button and let the game play for me.


This is what he said:

Source: http://gematsu.com/2014/09/final-fa...nt-open-world-combat-demo#4zRwaxD0breSEGRC.99

Also, let me say, your idea of pre-programming commands like that I think is terrible, and I would utterly hate the idea of it, it just reminds me of FFXIII to chain combos together... FFXIII's battle system was shit, I don't want to play FFXIII, I want to play XV... and XV should be what Nomura envisioned, not this watered down press X to win.

Like I said, it was an "example". I am not trying to be mean but the way you talk to people sometimes comes off as intimidating/rude.

Also, what he is saying may not be relevant 1-1.5 years from now. We are at the 55% mark after all. FFXIII was painted in a different way about a year before it's release ( FFXIII demo that is). The final product will be different than what he is describing now, I kinda expect it.
 

Takoyaki

SOLDIER Second Class
May 27, 2014
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#36
Think Type-0 but more simple. Also, think of press triangle to win button like in KH. Oh and Gambits!

I expected change, but not this much. I won't overreact and I'll wait till I play the demo, but I hope they consider feed back and make it so that you can manually string combos together at least.
 

LeonBlade

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#37
Like I said, it was an "example". I am not trying to be mean but the way you talk to people sometimes comes off as intimidating/rude.

Also, what he is saying may not be relevant 1-1.5 years from now. We are at the 55% mark after all. FFXIII was painted in a different way about a year before it's release ( FFXIII demo that is). The final product will be different than what he is describing now, I kinda expect it.
I don't mean to insult you, I simply mean that I don't like the idea of it, sorry if you are offended, not my intention, I am simply just upset over all of this right now.

It's hard to tell if the combat is hack & slash now. There's not enough button spamming nor does the combat sound fast paced at all. Is this still considered to be an Action RPG still?
I don't feel like it does deserve to be considered an ARPG. In other ARPGs with multiple weapons you can chose which weapon you want to use when you want to use it... even if this wasn't an issue, having to hold down a button to attack and pre-programming combo strings sounds like a snooze fest. I enjoyed the versatility of enabling and disabling abilities in KH to get the combo strings I wanted, and executing them based on how I chose to attack.

Two of the biggest problems is.
1. I can't change my weapon when I want to.
2. I can't mash attack and defend when I want to.

It's so ironic that you are given so much free range and ability but the combat system is so limited.
 

LeonBlade

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#39
Think Type-0 but more simple. Also, think of press triangle to win button like in KH.
You can not press Triangle to win in KH, in many situations pressing Triangle simply executed a contextual action against an enemy, like Reversal on the Nobodies in order to swiftly dodge around to their backs to get attacks in. If you played KH2 on Critical Mode, it's not press Triangle to win, you can die very easily if you don't know what you're doing.

The freedom to combo the way YOU want and to block/parry the way YOU is one of the BEST features in KH's battle system, not let the game do it for you. Having to roll/block from enemy attacks punished you for not paying attention to your enemy, this idea of changing to a stance to avoid everything just sounds too automated and casual.

As for Type-0 but more simple, that means removing everything that made Type-0 somewhat of a flexible battle system.
 

Takoyaki

SOLDIER Second Class
May 27, 2014
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#40
I don't feel like it does deserve to be considered an ARPG. In other ARPGs with multiple weapons you can chose which weapon you want to use when you want to use it... even if this wasn't an issue, having to hold down a button to attack and pre-programming combo strings sounds like a snooze fest. I enjoyed the versatility of enabling and disabling abilities in KH to get the combo strings I wanted, and executing them based on how I chose to attack.

Two of the biggest problems is.
1. I can't change my weapon when I want to.
2. I can't mash attack and defend when I want to.

It's so ironic that you are given so much free range and ability but the combat system is so limited.
That's the struggle, they've made basically everything run on gambits/menu. Kind of like XIII's paradigm shift. Now there's a preset limit of how many weapons you can actually "use" No way to have all 8 or whatever.

Controls are also way too simple.

You can not press Triangle to win in KH, in many situations pressing Triangle simply executed a contextual action against an enemy, like Reversal on the Nobodies in order to swiftly dodge around to their backs to get attacks in. If you played KH2 on Critical Mode, it's not press Triangle to win, you can die very easily if you don't know what you're doing.
I'm aware. It's just become a meme so I had to mention it, lol.
 
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