Everything FFXV Datamining Related

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Ikkin

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Oct 30, 2016
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no 90

Pokerfuckingface, such a better and more detailed discourse, connecting that event with previous happenings for example than the final one. Fuck it, man ;(

This scene was on Noctis pov and even then it was digested, there are definitely other reasons for these decisions.
I... actually like the updated version better, and the differences certainly seem to be the result of a change in direction rather than a lack of time.

To mention a few positive changes:
  • Luna in the early version spoke as if she somehow failed in her responsibilities because Niflheim attacked Lucis. Luna in the final version is far more aware of her true position, pointing out that even as she speaks, Niflheim might be clamping down on her ("little hope that the words I speak... shall reach beyond these walls").
  • The early version blamed the darkness in humanity that led to the fall of Lucis on the supernatural darkness that she was fighting against. The final version recognizes that humanity doesn't need supernatural darkness to commit horrific acts... which actually fits much better with the modern origin of the Starscourge as the result of a totalitarian state with no concern for human life attempting to play God. (It's also much, much more applicable to real life, lol.)
  • The early version had Luna make a far narrower promise to try to convince Leviathan. In the final version, Luna's eyes are fully set on the future threat of the Starscourge itself.
This one should be interesting to see translated...
 

Ikkin

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Oct 30, 2016
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I had used Google Translate on the dataminer's tweet itself above the image, and it said Noctis, Ardyn, and Bahamut, and it ended off with an emote. As for the Japanese dialogue, I'm not sure.
Using Japanese OCR and Google Translate (lol), it seems like it's a comparison between the draft version of the conversation between Noct and Bahamut and the final version of the conversation between Ardyn and Bahamut.
 
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Storm

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Oct 26, 2013
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Lmao I can't.
Those cables were not even mentioned in the game.

I agree with some your points Ikkin, but the first one is more to my liking. It better conveys the urgency of the situation, and gives more context and information in an otherwise rushed chapter. The discourse as it is feels incomplete given all the stakes.
 
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Storm

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Ikkin

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It's kind of weird how there are a few bits of lore in here that add to a full understanding of the final game's story (like Bahamut explaining that Noct can understand him because Luna gave him that power and the expansion of the idea -- referenced by Luna's attempted healing of Ardyn -- that daemonization essentially traps souls), while other parts are better explained by the final game (like what the Crystal actually is, the relevance of the throne, and, most importantly, why Noct has to die).

In general, while the entirety of canon Noct's dialogue takes the form of player-selected questions, he feels... a lot more curious and active than the draft version, who basically just acts flustered and does a lot of 'Metal Gear'ing.

Draft Noct didn't ask where he was or what happened to his friends, so he remained completely in the dark in regards to the two most important things a normal person would want to know under the circumstances. He didn't ask what the deal was with Ardyn or the nature of the power Bahamut was referring to, so he ended up knowing next to nothing about either of those things, either. Then Bahamut told him he had to die without explaining any purpose it could possibly serve, and he quite reasonably flipped out, but ended up either resigning himself to dying Just Because or getting outright brainwashed.

(Canon Noct, in contrast, knew where he was and why, that his friends were both alive and holding down the fort for him, who Ardyn was and why he must be stopped, and that he was being asked to give his life to take down an existential threat and bring back the dawn. Freaking out the way draft Noct did would come off as cowardly and selfish.)

The other weird thing is this line: "When the True King awakens, your consciousness will return to nothingness and you will receive a peaceful death." Apart from the fact that it seems like a downright lie in light of the kind of death Noct eventually suffered... is this meant to imply that Noct's consciousness was intended to be essentially replaced by the "True King" at some point? Because that... doesn't make a whole lot of sense in the context of anything like the final game we received.
 

Storm

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It's kind of weird how there are a few bits of lore in here that add to a full understanding of the final game's story (like Bahamut explaining that Noct can understand him because Luna gave him that power and the expansion of the idea -- referenced by Luna's attempted healing of Ardyn -- that daemonization essentially traps souls), while other parts are better explained by the final game (like what the Crystal actually is, the relevance of the throne, and, most importantly, why Noct has to die).

In general, while the entirety of canon Noct's dialogue takes the form of player-selected questions, he feels... a lot more curious and active than the draft version, who basically just acts flustered and does a lot of 'Metal Gear'ing.

Draft Noct didn't ask where he was or what happened to his friends, so he remained completely in the dark in regards to the two most important things a normal person would want to know under the circumstances. He didn't ask what the deal was with Ardyn or the nature of the power Bahamut was referring to, so he ended up knowing next to nothing about either of those things, either. Then Bahamut told him he had to die without explaining any purpose it could possibly serve, and he quite reasonably flipped out, but ended up either resigning himself to dying Just Because or getting outright brainwashed.

(Canon Noct, in contrast, knew where he was and why, that his friends were both alive and holding down the fort for him, who Ardyn was and why he must be stopped, and that he was being asked to give his life to take down an existential threat and bring back the dawn. Freaking out the way draft Noct did would come off as cowardly and selfish.)

The other weird thing is this line: "When the True King awakens, your consciousness will return to nothingness and you will receive a peaceful death." Apart from the fact that it seems like a downright lie in light of the kind of death Noct eventually suffered... is this meant to imply that Noct's consciousness was intended to be essentially replaced by the "True King" at some point? Because that... doesn't make a whole lot of sense in the context of anything like the final game we received.

you are into something.

"When I become King, it won't be me anymore".

That kinda implies he gets possessed by this True King entity. Interesting.


Im not crying, you are ;(
 
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Ikkin

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Oct 30, 2016
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you are into something.

"When I become King, it won't be me anymore".

That kinda implies he gets possessed by this True King entity. Interesting.
I am so glad they changed this. So much of the emotional impact of the ending was that the True King who suffered was still Noct -- having him replaced by some other entity before the end would have been weird.

There are some meaningful losses in the second tweet... but that reunion scene, sheesh. It feels like the bros are more concerned with conveying their own displeasure than with supporting the guy who's about to sacrifice himself to save the world. =/
 

Storm

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Gotta agree, Noctis being "possessed" by (or turned into this divine higher) True King wouldn't have the same emotional impact.

I quite liked some of the lines in the alt. campfire scene, but the silence of the final version was powerful in its own way.
 

FFChocobo18

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Jan 9, 2017
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Gotta agree, Noctis being "possessed" by (or turned into this divine higher) True King wouldn't have the same emotional impact.

I quite liked some of the lines in the alt. campfire scene, but the silence of the final version was powerful in its own way.
Yeah, the 'possesed True King entity' wasn't a big loss at all, and not needed at all, and the game came out better without it.
 

Ikkin

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Oct 30, 2016
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Yeah, the 'possesed True King entity' wasn't a big loss at all, and not needed at all, and the game came out better without it.
I'm really hoping that Calary7 finds the lines from the previous datamine about "become a King"/"become a God"/"become a human," because I feel like that could explain a lot about the draft version she (?) found.

Given the sum total of removed content we're aware of at this point, I suspect the evolution of the ending is as follows:
  • In the earliest known version, the player was meant to be given a choice about what to do, either at the end of the game or during the Revelation of Bahamut. As in a certain other Tabata-directed game, staying human would be the right choice (and probably would have involved fighting Ardyn's supposed monster form as the "true final boss.")
  • At some later point, the choice was removed, and the "become a King" ending was selected as the most emotionally compelling once choice was taken out of the picture (probably with Ardyn's monster form tacked on). The dialogue, however, still reflected the sense of unease that said ending was meant to evoke when it was still a "bad" ending.
  • The ending scenes were then modified into their current form to remove the sense that things shouldn't have turned out the way that they did (and Ardyn's monster form was dropped due to its lack of emotional relevance in the final game's context).
 

FFChocobo18

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Jan 9, 2017
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Some more unused dialogue in Chapters 5 and 9.:




The inquiry about Ravus' arm in the deleted content of that scene in Chapter 9, though we already knew about but we now know who was saying what in this case and wish the deleted content in this scene stayed in the final version but oh well, seemed to have been repurposed a bit by Ignis in Episode Ignis, but I'm not too keen on that, as it's been a while, so correct me if I'm wrong.
 
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Storm

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Once again, these extra dialogues would have added gravitas and a better context of the stakes at play.

Its just a shame, it seems like every scene we got was digested and instead of them refilling with something else they left them as it is, half-baked scenes that led to half-baked rushed story exposition and presentation.

A shame.
 
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FFChocobo18

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Jan 9, 2017
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Once again, these extra dialogues would have added gravitas and a better context of the stakes at play.

Its just a shame, it seems like every scene we got was digested and instead of them refilling with something else they left them as it is, half-baked scenes that led to half-baked rushed story exposition and presentation.

A shame.
Yeah, especially Ravus' unused lines with Lunafreya in that flashback in Altissia from Chapter 12, as well as this Chapter 9 scene that was cut in half, which shouldn't have happened in my opinion. A lot of these deleted lines add context and addressed stuff, and giving exposition.
 
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Ikkin

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Oct 30, 2016
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Once again, these extra dialogues would have added gravitas and a better context of the stakes at play.

Its just a shame, it seems like every scene we got was digested and instead of them refilling with something else they left them as it is, half-baked scenes that led to half-baked rushed story exposition and presentation.

A shame.
I feel like the draft scenes felt overly wordy and should have undergone an editing pass or two, but the amount of actual information that was cut out was... not what it needed.

With that said, I'd gladly give it all up if getting it back meant losing the final version of the Revelation of Bahamut and the ending. >_>;
 

FFChocobo18

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I feel like the draft scenes felt overly wordy and should have undergone an editing pass or two, but the amount of actual information that was cut out was... not what it needed.

With that said, I'd gladly give it all up if getting it back meant losing the final version of the Revelation of Bahamut and the ending. >_>;
The deleted content I would like to see back would be the deleted lines from Chapter 9, some of the lines of the lines from the original version of the reunion of Chapter 14, but without the 'True King' entity implications as those are unnecessary and I prefer how the final game turned out about it, and the deleted Ravus and Lunafreya lines from the flashback in Chapter 12, but that's just my opinion, feel free to agree or disagree, I'm interested in what you'd want back, if anything at all, I'm curious.