Final Fantasy XVI - General News Thread

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Feb 19, 2018
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Something curious about the trailer is that the protagonist has 3 costumes. The one at the beginning / prologue, then another after what seems like a time-skip, where he is an adult, and then another.





Second outfit gives off military grunt vibes with the last outfit having a "I must answer my calling as the hero" vibe to it. Obviously the teaser doesn't give us too much to work off of in terms of story but I think in the second pic our protagonist is probably serving as fodder under someone or a group/organization that he doesn't want to work for hence the sullen stare into the fire as he touches his cheek when, what sounds like his superior, says "our kind doesn't question orders." It's a very "I'm questioning my worth right now" reaction from our protagonist and gives off the vibe that he's hit rock bottom at that point as far as I choose to personally interpret it. Act 1 or the sequence of events where he's shown as a young man, depending on how they choose to structure the story, must definitely end in some sort of crushing defeat to force him into a situation he seems to look very displeased with.

I noticed something else in the last gif. The insignia on the dragoon's cloak under all that blood is nearly identical to one of the two crossed tattoos on the protagonist's face in his grizzled version shown at the beginning and end of the trailer.
Maybe our hero is conscripted into the imperial military after his kingdom falls. The fact that the symbol is on the Dragoon's cape who is adorned with very ornate armor while our guy just has it slapped on his face and is basically branded like cattle along with all his squad mates is a detail that definitely lends itself to the idea that the MC is starting as a fodder grunt in the enemy military post timeskip. Given that Phoenix is a focal point of the story maybe his own rebirth after the initial defeat is a driving plot point of the story. Finding new purpose after losing it when his old life was taken from him.
 
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Cloud_CR

Blitzball Champion
Oct 26, 2017
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Costa Rica
Some of the enemies seen in the trailer and their designs for this game.

-Goblin:



-Troll/Ogre (any other guesses? Maybe it's simply a Big Boy Goblin. He looks straight out of The Hobbit):



-Coeurl:



-Malboro:



-Mage (any guesses as to the type?):



-Dragoon (he's a big guy):



-Knight:



-Bonus knight (seems like an enemy, but could he be a guest? Although the face being covered tells me it's an enemy):

@ResetEra
 

Ikkin

Warrior of Light
Oct 30, 2016
1,093
1,694
I prefer how Titan looks in XVI though. Also, I don't see any discernible difference in quality between XV's Titan or XVI's Titan whatsoever. I'm really not sure what you mean by your comments on XV's looking better. If you could explain in further detail, that would be appreciated.
You can prefer XVI's Titan on a design level, but the XVI asset just seems far, far less impressive. I'll start with XVI's this time, then compare from there:



XVI Titan has a lot of jagged edges that scream "low-poly normal mapped UE3 model" to me. The rocks in the upper left quadrant next to Titan's face are particularly egregious in this regard -- if you trace the edges of the rock, there are straight lines dozens of pixels long that are offset by light responding to fake detail in the normal map. The normal maps in question are lower resolution than the base texture, which results in a weird grainy/blurry look to the image overall.

I will admit that I'm probably overly sensitive to low-poly normal mapped UE3 models; I despised them in the PS3 era and I'm still rather allergic. But when I look at FFXVI Titan, I see the same sort of faults that I see in something like Gears of War, just an order of magnitude less eye-gouging:



(Note again the extended straight lines pretending not to be straight thanks to lighting that responds to textures rather than polygons... with the unfortunate consequence of the lighting feeling blotchy due to quarter-res normal maps. Ugh.)

Now, let's take a look at FFXV Titan:



FFXV Titan is full of all of the organic curves that XVI Titan lacks. He looks like this with completely flat lighting:



The reason why he retains all of his detail under such conditions is because practically all of his detail is polygonal -- at 400,000 poly, he's made of more triangles than Cloud from Advent Children. And when proper lighting is applied to such a model, there's no mismatch between the edges of the actual model and where the edges are supposed to be according to the normal map.

I also find that XV's lighting while impressive, also has a lot of flaws with really awkward self illumination in a lot of situations, and of course the poor AA etc. A lot of these things hamper the overall quality of XV. I think XVI looks really good right now, and I think that XVI will ultimately look a lot better than XV in the long run.
Until full raycasting is implemented, dynamic lighting is always going to break in some circumstances. Either XVI will use static lighting, or it will break just as egregiously sometimes.

With regards to the AA, though, that might be a problem on consoles, but it's not a problem with the Windows Edition. To the extent that XVI solved the problem, I'd be shocked if the solution didn't come down to the 4k resolution. =P

It's weird though, some people say that XVI looks like a PS3 game which is baffling to me. Other people think it runs on Luminous. I don't know why the community is so split on graphics.
I think it's because of the low-poly normal mapped look. Some people are almost completely oblivious to the difference between low-poly normal mapped models and their fully-polygonal equivalents, while others think it's a massive leap. (I actually think the difference between PS3 and PS4 is more impressive than the difference between PS2 and PS3, because the low-poly normal mapped look is the visual equivalent of nails on a chalkboard. >_>; )
 
Feb 19, 2018
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Some of the enemies seen in the trailer and their designs for this game.



@ResetEra
Damn that Coeurl design looks majestic as fuck, wasn't able to get a good look at it until now. Graphics aside I'm actually really digging the art and design direction of this game quite a bit. I'd honestly be down to have this be the new look/aesthetic for the franchise going forward for a while, would be a nice break from Nomura designing everything for the last decade. The new art style's probably the biggest contributor to why FFXVI feels so refreshing to look at for me personally.
 

Noctis_Caelum

Chocobo Knight
Jul 15, 2014
212
284
Honestly yeah XVI looks less epic/surprising by it's graphics than XV.
But...
1. The game is still in development and everything can still change like in XV
2. Graphics are not everything. I want a good storystelling and fun gameplay. And XV was for me at least the opposite.

So I'm interested how exactly the battle system will work and the story sounds also interesting and we have FINALLY BLOOD in a main FF game.
So I'm curious why 7Remake had almost no blood, perhaps XVI will be rated M??
 
Likes: Somber
Hi guys, long time no see!

I'm a bit late for the discussion but I don't believe the most talked topic is... Graphics?
Just to put this aside, I think these gifs already prove the graphics are actually better than FFXV and FFVII Remake:

Gifs about gameplay mechanics of Final Fantasy XVI.







Really... Look how clean the graphics and animations are... How the scenario around the characters are full of details and well modeled. I think you forgot how FFXV really looked. Just compare the trees around the gif and these ones:



I think the question is the COMPLETELY different art style and some people think it's worse. I'm really sad about how most people received the game and are telling it's a downgrade compared to the last games... Just because the art style reminds them Final Fantasy XIV.

Come on, lets look at some Final Fantasy VII Remake screenshots too:





Aside from the good looking characters, there are low poly things EVERYWHERE in Final Fantasy VII Remake... (and don't forget about the "fake sky" with a stretched image)

Just to finish, I'm really glad they had the guts to reveal the game itself (gameplay, cutscenes and all) and not just a CGI. I think the game will look better close to the release but now we have a good picture of how the game really is.
 

NikoZ

PSICOM Soldier
Feb 18, 2018
82
115
20
Hi guys, long time no see!

I'm a bit late for the discussion but I don't believe the most talked topic is... Graphics?
Just to put this aside, I think these gifs already prove the graphics are actually better than FFXV and FFVII Remake:



Really... Look how clean the graphics and animations are... How the scenario around the characters are full of details and well modeled. I think you forgot how FFXV really looked. Just compare the trees around the gif and these ones:



I think the question is the COMPLETELY different art style and some people think it's worse. I'm really sad about how most people received the game and are telling it's a downgrade compared to the last games... Just because the art style reminds them Final Fantasy XIV.

Come on, lets look at some Final Fantasy VII Remake screenshots too:





Aside from the good looking characters, there are low poly things EVERYWHERE in Final Fantasy VII Remake... (and don't forget about the "fake sky" with a stretched image)

Just to finish, I'm really glad they had the guts to reveal the game itself (gameplay, cutscenes and all) and not just a CGI. I think the game will look better close to the release but now we have a good picture of how the game really is.
Ummm...that's a screenshot from Episode Duscae, thus literally proving nothing. BUT I am on of those who think that XVI looked great in the trailer
 
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Ikkin

Warrior of Light
Oct 30, 2016
1,093
1,694
Ummm...that's a screenshot from Episode Duscae, thus literally proving nothing. BUT I am on of those who think that XVI looked great in the trailer
Using a screenshot from Episode Duscae absolutely proves something. ;) Unfortunately, it proves the exact opposite of what it's intended to prove -- namely, that comparing FFXV itself wouldn't conduce to the desired result.









(Using Comrades since it has the most comparable trees... but the character creator holds up shockingly well in a competition with a bespoke next-gen hero model!)
 
Likes: Noctis_Caelum

Somber

SOLDIER Second Class
Nov 22, 2013
307
304
Episode Duscae was nice but they downgraded the graphics in the final iteration. ;)

Comrades was nice idea but it's absolutely dead. Turns out the fans don't really care about the graphics that holds up!
 

NikoZ

PSICOM Soldier
Feb 18, 2018
82
115
20
Episode Duscae was nice but they downgraded the graphics in the final iteration. ;)

Comrades was nice idea but it's absolutely dead. Turns out the fans don't really care about the graphics that holds up!
The only thing that looks worse in the final version of the game, was the water and a particle effect or two...everything else was objectively improved and upgraded, though?
 

Somber

SOLDIER Second Class
Nov 22, 2013
307
304
The only thing that looks worse in the final version of the game, was the water and a particle effect or two...everything else was objectively improved and upgraded, though?
Not everything. Water and reflection got downgraded. And the final build lost some color tone, lighting and got too bright and almost bluish compared the Duscae build. I've attached some videos which have evidences of the case.



Graphics weren't an issue. But issues spawned due to the focus on graphics and cross media promotion. :hahaha:
 

Nova

Warrior of Light
Jul 14, 2015
1,735
2,532
Turns out the fans don't really care about the graphics that holds up!
Aside from at one point when the previous master build was shown off at Gamescom. Kappa

Graphics weren't an issue. But issues spawned due to the focus on graphics and cross media promotion. :hahaha:
I'm certain we could also add the game's turbulent development history/deadline among other things as a key contributer to various shortcomings tbf.
 

Ikkin

Warrior of Light
Oct 30, 2016
1,093
1,694
Not everything. Water and reflection got downgraded. And the final build lost some color tone, lighting and got too bright and almost bluish compared the Duscae build. I've attached some videos which have evidences of the case.

This video doesn't back you up on color tone or lighting -- in fact, DF sounds pretty confident that those aspects are artistic rather than technical choices, and they prefer the "more realistic" look in the final game!

I do think you have a case about water and reflections, but those aspects can't counter the massive improvements in all other areas.
 

Noctis_Caelum

Chocobo Knight
Jul 15, 2014
212
284
Using a screenshot from Episode Duscae absolutely proves something. ;) Unfortunately, it proves the exact opposite of what it's intended to prove -- namely, that comparing FFXV itself wouldn't conduce to the desired result.









(Using Comrades since it has the most comparable trees... but the character creator holds up shockingly well in a competition with a bespoke next-gen hero model!)
Man everytime i see this it impressives me how next-gen does the hair look.
But yeah for me gameplay is way more important than graphics.
And XIV does proofs this that it's also working with this strategy and hope XVI goes the same way.
 
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Ikkin

Warrior of Light
Oct 30, 2016
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1,694
I think we already reached a point where graphics are satisfying enough even when devs are not aiming for maximum output.
I think this is true to the extent that AA games like Kena and Stray can be ridiculously gorgeous... but having reached that point doesn't mean that all games that are released will achieve graphics that are satisfying enough, and I don't think FFXVI in particular has cleared that bar.
 

Jenova

Keyblade Master
Oct 28, 2013
726
583
Interesting scoop from Schreier. I think that a 2021-2022 release for Final Fantasy XVI makes sense considering we won't be seeing Final Fantasy VII Part 2 for awhile yet. Not until 2022-2023 maybe. We'll see how efficient the development environment for Playstation 5 is in the coming months and how willing developers are willing to move on from the Playstation 4. While Project Aitha seems to be a tentpole release for Square-Enix it's no Final Fantasy holdover. It also doesn't have a proper name so I also do not think we will see that game on store shelves for awhile yet. Leaving only Final Fantasy XVI as the next major release.
 
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Feb 19, 2018
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Interesting scoop from Schreier. I think that a 2021-2022 release for Final Fantasy XVI makes sense considering we won't be seeing Final Fantasy VII Part 2 for awhile yet. Not until 2022-2023 maybe. We'll see how efficient the development environment for Playstation 5 is in the coming months and how willing developers are willing to move on from the Playstation 4. While Project Aitha seems to be a tentpole release for Square-Enix it's no Final Fantasy holdover. It also doesn't have a proper name so I also do not think we will see that game on store shelves for awhile yet. Leaving only Final Fantasy XVI as the next major release.
An alternating schedule like that would make sense as it helps with filling the void between the Remake entries so they can work without rushing while making sure the FF hype doesn't die in the general public by having the series go dormant for too long. FF right now is the most relevant it's ever been since the PS2 era so they gotta strike while the iron is still hot.
 
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